Opinions on an Article

[onesiphorus]

Dear JIP whilst your earlier post was general it was still forwarding a philosophical and humanistic ideology which while being socially acceptable is not endorsed by the truth of the word .

It has nothing to do with intolerance ...the problem today is because of political correctness there is no allowances for accepting or respecting opposing viewpoints and that to disagree signals extremism or intolerance , whereas the reverse is true that by accepting that we as Christians are not the same , in ideology , as say a Conservative orthodox Jew , toleration is not even a consideration, I accept it is not the same .a muslim would never regard me as his brother no more than I would accept him , but that has nothing to do with whether he would be my friend .

Your comment about Jesus , to be biblically precise he came for the lost sheep of the house of Israel , in fact when praying in John chapter 17:9 , also i refer to His comment in John 15 :17-19 .

Being a christian does not mean you love everybody ini the same vain as the hippie ,spiritual , new age philosophy prevalent today , while religious councils liberalise and water down Christianity to fit the world JEsus Christ is moving further and further away from these philosophies , and it is taking on a facade of humanistic philosophy which is not christian . All his creations are not his children..where does it say that

[JIP]

Dear Onesi.. almost every poet in Christendom considered a Mohammedan to be an infidel, and an idolater, and his gods to be three. But in our Politically Correct age which denies the possibility of absolute truth, tolerance has come to mean embracing the other person and his views, or ideas, or behaviours, or worldview. Now if you considers that getting any two groups of people, be it religious or social, to stop shooting at each other, and getting them to sit down and discuss issues isphilosophical and humanistic ideology what can I say my friend?


I do not want to spell out all the major differences between two religions. I also do not wish to discuss the strengths and weaknesses of interfaith dialogue because my fear is simply that in the attempt to promote a good thing or brotherhood among mankind (the reduction of violence and religious conflict, and the need to learn to talk to one another) we will simply see a further deterioration of the truth claims of Biblical Christianity. That is, many people - including Christians - may be misled by this discussion into thinking that truth claims really are divisive and harmful, and that we should therefore just play down doctrinal, religious and ideological differences, in an effort to just get along.


I know very well that in all interfaith movements, the issue of the importance of doctrine and theological truth is ignored or radically downplayed. But how can one say that it is not God’s hand to see this through as a “spiritual union”. To promote love and brotherhood. How do we know the things of God?


The prophet Micah prophesied about a coming time when nations will stop making war. The various peoples of the world will live in peace and pursue their different religions, each worshipping their different Gods and Goddesses. Meanwhile, the Jews will continue to follow Jehovah. His prophesy came to pass for the known western world during the Roman Empire where religious were generally tolerated (except for the intermittent persecution of Christians). There has not been any period since the fall of the Roman Empire when tolerance of religious minorities has been generally observed worldwide.
Micah 4:3-5"...they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks: nation shall not lift up a sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig tree; and none shall make them afraid: for the mouth of the LORD of hosts hat spoken it. For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of the LORD our God for ever and ever."


Jesus' disciples had rejected a healer who was exorcising demons in Jesus' name, yet was not one of Jesus direct followers. Jesus criticized his disciples and accepted the healer. Mark and Luke report the incident in parallel passages:
Mark 9:38-40 "...we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbade him, because he followeth not us. But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me. For he that is not against us is on our part."
Luke 9:49-50 "...we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbade him, because he followeth not with us. And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us."

I promised myself that I would not use the verses in the bible vainly but I am helpless and sorry that I am still doing the things I said i would not but allow me a few more to say what Jesus taught us.

Jesus' teachings were rejected by the inhabitants of a village in Samaria. His disciples asked that he exterminate the people of the village by issuing a curse. Jesus refused to do it, and simply move on to the next village.
Luke 9:52-56: "...they did not receive him...And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did? But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village."

People often misuse the word of God by confusing the Christian Scriptures. They misuse the teaching that trusting in Jesus is the only way to be saved, and that only those persons who hear the Gospel and accept it will attain Heaven. However Romans 2:14-16, Paul writes: "For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another; In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel." Paul is here discussing those individuals who have not heard of the Mosaic law. Their lives will be reviewed on Judgment Day; they may be saved and attain heaven if they performed sufficient good works while alive on Earth. Why do we want to deny Catholics, Muslims, Interfaith, etc., this privilege?

I admire Lambsy who has been in our forum from the beginning. I learned from his tolerance and his calmness and also although HEYGwenCOG posted only a few posts I learned from his one post. I was ashamed and was ashamed that on how many counts I am a lesser because of the views of my brothers of the same denomination.

My point is simple: mainstream Christianity, Islam and Muslim governments do not persecute Christians or Jews. Those who preach such are a tiny minority. So are the doctrines preached, discussed and debated by my denomination against other denominations are a minority.

“So are you for the Kingdom of God which includes all of us, or are you for your own community against the rest of mankind?” The one is obviously the way of peace and human progress, the other the way of strife, oppression and calamity.

Be Blessed

[onesiphorus]

But JIP the only way for salvation is through Jesus Christ that is christianity , i am sorry but if you believe that the whole world is one big kingdom of God where all are saved then you are completely wrong . please enlarge on how else except through Christ are we saved , because I really want to know .

[JIP]

Yes onesi.. i know that and what you say is true
but please read at leisure and u will see my point through

i will try to answer your question too by tomorrow if you dont
mind

[onesiphorus]

I await your reply old friend

[JIP]

sure thing pal

[JIP]

Originally Posted by onesiphorus

,.....Being a christian does not mean you love everybody in the same vain as the hippie ,spiritual , new age philosophy prevalent today .................................................. .

All his creations are not his children..where does it say that

Dear Onesi.... in the 1st part of your above quote you say that we should not love another other than a christian of our faith... but one of Jesus's last message to mankind was to love everybody. Jesus did not qualify that we should not love a hippie, etc. Why then does man want to qualify and bring is division and .......

The 2nd part that all His creations are not His children.... Did God purposely create and abandon or is there a another creator for the children that are not His.

On the general points covered in my posts I think I have explained enough for a normal person to understand and used a few verses that was more than sufficient to back up what I was talking about.

I will only be able to answer specifically if you can ask me what exactly is not clear in my post ... but my dear Onesi... I think and feel that an agreement may not come by.. so what do you say...? I just gave my views on the topic.. didnt intend a debate actually.
Be Blessed
JIP

[onesiphorus]

dear JIP , when you express the view that there is another way to salvation apart from Christ Jesus and that you infer that there is universal salvation outside of the gospel and that the bible is not the inerrent and preserved word of God you cannot expect me to accept as a christian without expecting some more of an explanation and reason than God so loved the world then you are mistaken , I have asked you to show me where you can find another route to salvation and where everybody in the world is Gods child , so whether these were just wild random thoughts
does demand further comment or are you just trying to be controversial for controversial sake because what you are expressing is the complete antithesis of Christianity

[JIP]

Dear Onesi.. please do not think that I am trying to brush aside your questions..but i prefer to stay out of a debate....

And I think I dont need to defend myself because what you accuse is not true.

So my friend I bow out.

Be Blessed
JIP