Background To The Gifts of Tongues

[Pariah]

Although this site is presenting the case that tongues have ceased: if one scrolls down to the actual listing done for the Encyclopedia of the Pentecostal History, one can find in that listing cold spells or winter months where Biblical tongues with interpretation have ceased as well as times of famine and drought where tongues appeared without interpretation.

Encyclopedia of Pentecostal History of Tongues: 150 AD - 1901 AD

I am referring everyone to this listing of information used by this site for discussion.

Comparison and analysis of tongues for discernment is on the table here.

Although references to the RCC is mentioned in here: it is not the sole topic. Tongues is.

Can one establish the cause of the deviation from Biblical tongues to tongues without interpretation?

Can one establish the deviation of the purported claims of having Biblical tongues, but was proven that they did not have that gift so as to link the discernment with the question above this one?

Prove all things: may God help all to discern the mystery.

[Pariah]

I do find one deviation and that is when one is given the idea that another filling is needed or a continual filling is suggested as linking the tongue phenomenon.

The difference in how some have been found to not really have the gift of tongues would imply that by the same methodology I mentioned above for discernment of those that believed they had the gift of tongues by that method, may find that they actually do not thus being the same with those that did not have tongues by that same method.

In other words, seeking another spirit to receive to get tongues is the deviation because when we became believers in Jesus Christ, we are filled and thus the reason why we do not hunger nor thirst anymore after coming to and believing in Jesus Christ.

We have been made complete as in bought with a price to be a new creature hence a new wineskin able to hold the new wine and sealed as in preserved and saved as His.

Matthew 9:17 & Colossians 2:5-10 & 1 Corinthians 1:22-31

That is why there is no other spirit to receive even if they call that spirit, the Holy Spirit, because Jesus gave the Holy Spirit by promise as He can only be received by faith in Jesus Christ: Galatians 3:14

Believers should know that the sure identification to others as in both believers and non-believers is our faith in Jesus Christ as identifying us as the children of God. Galatians 3:26

This is true since many of the tongue users after the early church days are linked with the cults.

What seperates us from the cults & the occults? Our faith in Jesus Christ.

What unites us with the cults & the occults? Tongues without interpretation.

The good fight is keeping the faith: not defending tongues without interpretation.

So there is no other spirit to receive in order to get tongues: 2 Corinthians 11:1-4

As it is the best way to avoid this 1 Timothy 4:1-2

And there is no need for calling for the Holy Spirit to come when He is already in you as promised in according to our faith in Jesus Christ: 2 Corinthians 13:5 & Ephesians 1:12-15 & 1 Corinthians 12:13 & Ephesians 4:4-6

So rest in Jesus Christ by mixing that faith in Whom you believe: Hebrews 4:1-16

[streetsinger]

I do find one deviation and that is when one is given the idea that another filling is needed or a continual filling is suggested as linking the tongue phenomenon.

The difference in how some have been found to not really have the gift of tongues would imply that by the same methodology I mentioned above for discernment of those that believed they had the gift of tongues by that method, may find that they actually do not thus being the same with those that did not have tongues by that same method.

In other words, seeking another spirit to receive to get tongues is the deviation because when we became believers in Jesus Christ, we are filled and thus the reason why we do not hunger nor thirst anymore after coming to and believing in Jesus Christ.

We have been made complete as in bought with a price to be a new creature hence a new wineskin able to hold the new wine and sealed as in preserved and saved as His.

Matthew 9:17 & Colossians 2:5-10 & 1 Corinthians 1:22-31

That is why there is no other spirit to receive even if they call that spirit, the Holy Spirit, because Jesus gave the Holy Spirit by promise as He can only be received by faith in Jesus Christ: Galatians 3:14

Believers should know that the sure identification to others as in both believers and non-believers is our faith in Jesus Christ as identifying us as the children of God. Galatians 3:26

This is true since many of the tongue users after the early church days are linked with the cults.

What seperates us from the cults & the occults? Our faith in Jesus Christ.

What unites us with the cults & the occults? Tongues without interpretation.

The good fight is keeping the faith: not defending tongues without interpretation.

So there is no other spirit to receive in order to get tongues: 2 Corinthians 11:1-4

As it is the best way to avoid this 1 Timothy 4:1-2

And there is no need for calling for the Holy Spirit to come when He is already in you as promised in according to our faith in Jesus Christ: 2 Corinthians 13:5 & Ephesians 1:12-15 & 1 Corinthians 12:13 & Ephesians 4:4-6

So rest in Jesus Christ by mixing that faith in Whom you believe: Hebrews 4:1-16

I have to stand on my experience in this matter. The Spirit moves as and when he pleases. In our fellowship he is present and manifests in most of our meetings, moving through various people to enlighten us as to his wishes. Mostly he calls us to pray for those he wishes to bless. Sometimes he will punctuate a teaching by filling me, these times are awkward as I am too filled to continue and have to ask him to ease off, but his presence is our joy. As for asking the Spirit to come and bless people, I have experienced this in conferences where he has moved through a conference centre and brought the conference to life. I have never been to sure of tongues, I am sometimes moved to pray in tongues quietly and, on occasions, am moved in the Spirit in doing so. It's fellowship with the Spirit that keeps me aware of who I am in Christ, the thought of him not being there, to me, is frightening.

[DeaconDan]

Can one establish the cause of the deviation from Biblical tongues to tongues without interpretation?

You will not find a Pentecostal to explain the deviation from biblical practice to the modern chaotic mess that does not edify the church. Their "holy spirit" does not lead them to knowledge or maturity, rather it serves as alcohol to give them a buzz and leads them astray as if a spirit of a demon.

[laterunner]

You will not find a Pentecostal to explain the deviation from biblical practice to the modern chaotic mess that does not edify the church. Their "holy spirit" does not lead them to knowledge or maturity, rather it serves as alcohol to give them a buzz and leads them astray as if a spirit of a demon.

><> ><> Thank God for some chaotic mess. Don't give the devil credit that you think is his.

If God left it all to us; naturally speaking, we would be stuck in the same seats each week or week day, counting the fluff in our navels, reading set words as prayers, not be excited or challenged, not feeling His presence & above all not really being involved in prayer, praise & worship .
In other words bound to this earthly realm.
''It was for freedom Christ set us free''
''Galatians 5
Freedom in Christ
1It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.''

Isn.t there more in ''the word'' than just black print on white paper. ????
Is what we do to demonstrate the Christ in us, what we see & hear & ''say'' is what is of God.
Christ is ''the word'' is He alive & at work as well as being in us.??????

[Chuckt]

><> ><> Thank God for some chaotic mess. Don't give the devil credit that you think is his.

If God left it all to us; naturally speaking, we would be stuck in the same seats each week or week day, counting the fluff in our navels, reading set words as prayers, not be excited or challenged, not feeling His presence & above all not really being involved in prayer, praise & worship .
In other words bound to this earthly realm.
''It was for freedom Christ set us free''
''Galatians 5
Freedom in Christ
1It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.''

Isn.t there more in ''the word'' than just black print on white paper. ????
Is what we do to demonstrate the Christ in us, what we see & hear & ''say'' is what is of God.
Christ is ''the word'' is He alive & at work as well as being in us.??????

I think there is more and it is called obedience. Obey by giving out the gospel instead of practicing your spiritual gift. Whole bookstores have opened their shelves to books bent on teaching you to practice your spiritual gift and they give no shelf space to books on evangelism or counter-cult evangelism. What people buy results in what people are thinking and practicing to the degree / percentage it is being sold.

[laterunner]

You will not find a Pentecostal to explain the deviation from biblical practice to the modern chaotic mess that does not edify the church. Their "holy spirit" does not lead them to knowledge or maturity, rather it serves as alcohol to give them a buzz and leads them astray as if a spirit of a demon.

''Be not drunk on wine but------''

[Chuckt]

''Be not drunk on wine but------''

Laterunner,

I seem to doubt a lot of Charisma having been in several charismatic churches for years. I haven't seen any healings but I have seen people chasing their doctors around and when they take their medicine they attribute it to God instead of their medication.

If you look at the history of Charisma, you have individuals blackmailing churches and claiming to be modern day prophets. They do whatever feels right and throw discernment and doctrine out.

My family stopped going to church after being invited to one. They were horribly offended by what went on in there. There are several problems and some of it is over the top. How do you then witness to people who close their eyes? You can't because it is very hard. The charismatic church does a lot of damage to people who want to believe.

The church is divided on the sign gifts and I actually can't say that it is 50/50 because I'm not even sure what percentage it is by population but by denominations it may not be 50/50 and forcing people to take a position just divides Christians.

The problem with charisma is the charismatic church members would tread doctrine as it is dead and you need a word from the Lord and the Lord is their teacher because a lot of them will no longer sit and listen to sound doctrine. Their argument is the letter kills and the spirit gives life so that is why so many of them are down on doctrine.

There are so many of them that have a word from the Lord. They say all of these false things that never come to pass and yet they never consider themselves a false prophet. They said I would marry this girl who likes a red jeep and it never happened. These kind of revelations are condescending and their spirituality puts a chip on their shoulder; "I'm better or more spiritual than you." Because they have a spiritual chip on their shoulder, might equals right and they do stuff like try to throw me around the room to bully me.

I invite you to visit "Jesus gift and book store" up in Iselin New Jersey though they have books for those going to academic colleges. Whole sections of their bookstore are on experiencing your spiritual gift. Gone are books on personal evangelism or counter cult evangelism because the church has become a spiritual amusement park and the mission of evangelism has been forgotten due to their new spirituality.

The gifts given to the church are for the edification of believers. That is why Churches like some Calvary Chapels will practice it behind closed doors but not the Assemblies of God who think it is for the edification of non-believers. They think that non-believers will believe and I can make an argument that it won't believe:

1 Cr. 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.

If the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit then why is the Assemblies of God church always forcing speaking of tongues on people if the natural man won't receive it? I listened to my four year old when he was two speak in a baby tongues and I thought there was something alike what is happening in the Assemblies of God church; adults like being immature.

The Charismatic Church has allowed Oneness Pentecostals to infiltrate their ranks (those who don't believe in the Trinity). The Charismatic church has allowed the Word Faith movement (a cult) to infiltrate or piggyback in their church. The Charismatic church has allowed the Toronto Blessing (unHoly Laughter) movement to infiltrate churches with unbiblical practices of people barking like dogs and running around the room. False theologies like Kingdom Now and the false Fivefold Ministries are part of this movement. Apostle so and so pretends to have authority over you and me.

My stepsister died from wanting God to heal her; not taking full chemotherapy treatments because she wanted to be healed and chemo makes you sterile which is why she rejected it and the cancer came back and killed her.

You might as well give up evangelism with this movement because they would rather practice their spiritual gift and you can no longer tell them what the scripture means because their spirit has become their arbiter of truth.

The reason we have the scripture is for the charismatic who says "I think God told me to divorce my wife."

There are a lot of problems there.

1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

My innoculation for you is to tell them "Do you mind if I don't believe you?" because many false spirits aren't of God and many false prophets are gone out into the world. If John doesn't believe them then what is wrong with you not believing them?


Moriarty, Michael, G., "The New Charismatics", A Concerned Voice Responds to Dangerous New Trends

[laterunner]

any answers to my queries???

[smellycat]

i don,t have the gift of tongues .Good for the ones who do/dont.