Why Greek?

[Richard_1]

DeaconDan wrote
[quote] Your teacher has distorted Romans. The issue is not what makes someone "righteous". It is what makes someone a "Jew". Romans 2:29, "A man is a Jew... by the Spirit" Not, "A man is righteous... by the Spirit."

This is a study by Matthew Henry that reflects exactly what Chuck Smith said and what I have said

If Jew and Gentile stand so much upon the same level before God, what advantage then hath the Jew? Hath not God often spoken with a great deal of respect for the Jews, as a non-such people (Deu. 33:29), a holy nation, a peculiar treasure, the seed of Abraham his friend: Did not he institute circumcision as a badge of their church-membership, and a seal of their covenant-relation to God? Now does not this levelling doctrine deny them all such prerogatives, and reflect dishonour upon the ordinance of circumcision, as a fruitless insignificant thing.

Answer. The Jews are, notwithstanding this, a people greatly privileged and honoured, have great means and helps, though these be not infallibly saving (v. 2): Much every way. The door is open to the Gentiles as well as the Jews, but the Jews have a fairer way up to this door, by reason of their church-privileges, which are not to be undervalued, though many that have them perish eternally for not improving them. He reckons up many of the Jews’ privileges Rom. 9:4, 5; here he mentions but one (which is indeed instar omnium—equivalent to all), that unto them were committed the oracles of God, that is, the scriptures of the Old Testament, especially the law of Moses, which is called the lively oracles (Acts 7:38), and those types, promises, and prophecies, which relate to Christ and the gospel. The scriptures are the oracles of God: they are a divine revelation, they come from heaven, are of infallible truth, and of eternal consequence as oracles. The Septuagint call the Urim and Thummim the logia—the oracles. The scripture is our breast-plate of judgment. We must have recourse to the law and to the testimony, as to an oracle. The gospel is called the oracles of God, Heb. 5:12; 1 Pt. 4:11. Now these oracles were committed to the Jews; the Old Testament was written in their language; Moses and the prophets were of their nation, lived among them, preached and wrote primarily to and for the Jews. They were committed to them as trustees for succeeding ages and churches. The Old Testament was deposited in their hands, to be carefully preserved pure and uncorrupt, and so transmitted down to posterity. The Jews were the Christians’ library-keepers, were entrusted with that sacred treasure for their own use and benefit in the first place, and then for the advantage of the world; and, in preserving the letter of the scripture, they were very faithful to their trust, did not lose one iota or tittle, in which we are to acknowledge God’s gracious care and providence. The Jews had the means of salvation, but they had not the monopoly of salvation. Now this he mentions with a chiefly, proµton men gar—this was their prime and principal privilege. The enjoyment of God’s word and ordinances is the chief happiness of a people, is to be put in the imprimis of their advantages, Deu. 4:8; 33:3; Ps. 147:20.

And this is a commentary from John Calvin about these same verses

Now the oracles were committed to them, for the purpose of preserving them as long as it pleased the Lord to continue his glory among them, and then of publishing them during the time of their stewardship through the whole world: they were first depositories, and secondly dispensers.

DeaconDan wrote

Having the Word of God is a tremendous advantage. But, outward-Jews wasted that advantage with their disbelief. The church has been entrusted with preserving the Word of God for the last 2000 years.

You seem intent on eliminating the Jews in Gods plan. But you seem to miss the fact that God has not eliminated the Jews

Romans 11:17-18 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

Romans 11:23-27 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again. For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree? For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

[DeaconDan]

This is a study by Matthew Henry that reflects exactly what Chuck Smith said and what I have said

If Jew and Gentile stand so much upon the same level before God, what advantage then hath the Jew? Hath not God often spoken with a great deal of respect for the Jews, as a non-such people (Deu. 33:29), a holy nation, a peculiar treasure, the seed of Abraham

Your teacher is again guilty of distorting scripture. The Hebrews are not the seed of Abraham, according to the promise. What the Old Testament implies, the New testament spells out clearly enough for a child to understand, the seed of Abraham, according to the promise, is Jesus. The only children of Abraham then are those who belong to God through Christ. Goats blood does not do it.

In Deu 33:29, Moses, leading what Luke calls "the Church in the Wilderness", praises "Israel", but there had never been a physical state of Israel at that time. The Israel of God which Moses praises is the same one spoken of in in Ephesians, "Remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus... you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens."

Romans 11:17-18 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree; Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.

You seem to deny that those branches were broken off. And, you seem to not recognize the reason, given two verses later, "they were broken off because of unbelief." It is not by birth, but by faith, we belong to the root, which is Christ.

Romans 11:23-27 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again. For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree? For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

That is the same deal God has with all men.

30-32For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

[Richard_1]

DeaconDan wrote

The Hebrews are not the seed of Abraham, according to the promise.

Lets look at what Jesus said to the Jews

John 8:37 I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.

John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.

It seems as though Jesus recognized the Jews as the seed of Abraham

DeaconDan wrote

, but there had never been a physical state of Israel at that time.

Yes there was and it started with Jacob and his twelve children. God recognizes Israel many times in Genesis and in Exodus. In fact God tells Moses to go and deliver His people Israel out of the bondage of Egypt. God saw that Israel was His nation of people.

Exodus 3:10 Come now therefore, and I will send thee unto Pharaoh, that thou mayest bring forth My people the children of Israel out of Egypt.

You seem so intent on eliminating Israel/Jews but I wonder if you ever read this that God spoke about Israel/Jews through the Holy Spirit to Paul

Romans 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

It is unfortunate that there is a certain branch of theology today that declares that God has cast away His people. They endeavor to spiritualize Israel to make it apply to the church, and those prophecies that relate to Israel they seek to relate to the church. This theology is called "replacement theology"

[DeaconDan]

Lets look at what Jesus said to the Jews

John 8:37 I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.

Interestingly, you stopped short of the next verses, 38-40, I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father.They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.

Jesus is ripping apart your racial theology. Jesus establishes that they are indeed the physical descendants of Abraham. But, then Jesus denies that they are Abraham's children by pointing out that they are not doing what Abraham would do. As far as the Promise is concerned, they are not children of Abraham. Then Jesus equates being a child of Abraham with being a child of God and delivers this clincher, 42a, Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me. Rather than children of Abraham, 44a Ye are of your father the devil.

Yes there was and it started with Jacob and his twelve children. God recognizes Israel many times in Genesis and in Exodus.

I said at that point there was no physical state
of Israel. Moses could not have been talking about a geopolitical country (i.e. the state of Israel). The nation he spoke of was spiritual. The saved members of that Church in the Wilderness were citizens of Israel, just as saved members of the Church are today. Moses does not address them as the seed of Jacob, but as the Assembly of Jacob.

You seem so intent on eliminating Israel/Jews but I wonder if you ever read this that God spoke about Israel/Jews through the Holy Spirit to Paul

Romans 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

Paul is boasting of his pedigree. He was not a nevoux Jew. He was deep into Judaism (priestly Judaism, not the modern rabbinicalism that passes for Judaism). I contend that it was his strong faith in God that won him a visit from Jesus. He was one of God's people by faith. God did not cast him away just because the Messiah had arrived.

Why would there even be a question of if God has cast away his people? By definition, God would not cast away his people. In the previous chapter, Paul says, 10-12, For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. This "neither Jew or Gentile" is not new with Jesus. It has always been the case. What has not always been the case is the arrived Messiah. What of God's people waiting for the Messiah, like Saul?

It is unfortunate that there is a certain branch of theology today that declares that God has cast away His people. They endeavor to spiritualize Israel to make it apply to the church, and those prophecies that relate to Israel they seek to relate to the church. This theology is called "replacement theology"

Are you a citizen of Israel?

[Richard_1]

DeaconDan wrote

The Hebrews are not the seed of Abraham, according to the promise.

Here you outright say that the Hebrews/Israel/Jews are not Abrahams seed. Yet in this next statement you admit that the Hebrews/Israel/Jews are the physical seed of Abraham

DeaconDan wrote

Jesus establishes that they are indeed the physical descendants of Abraham.

But then you will go on and point out the idea of the promise being different now and that promise is that we are the children of Abraham and Israel is cast off. As you intimate here

DeaconDan wrote
As far as the Promise is concerned, they are not children of Abraham.

But I ask what was the promise to Abraham. With the call of Abram, later named Abraham, God began a people whose descendants are living in ethnic purity to this very day. His plan was to call this man Abraham, and from him make a great nation of people who would be, not only the people from whom the Messiah would come, but also they would be God's chosen nation, a witness of God to all the earth. You would have it that God has forsaken Israel and has now substituted the Church in Israels place. Yet you seem to miss this statement about God honoring His promises

Romans 11:27-29 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

God has not cast off Israel nor has He taken the promise from them. God is not slack concerning His promises

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

So those promises that God gave the people Israel have not been cast off and will be fulfilled. When the times of the Gentiles comes its fullness then God will return His attention on Israel.

Romans 11:25-26 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Even the Prophets speak of this time. The blindness of Israel will be lifted and they will then do this

Zechariah 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.

The work of the Spirit in your heart is to bring you to the cross of Jesus Christ, to point you to the cross. And that will happen to Israel as a people of God "And they will look on Him whom they have pierced." In looking at the cross, the Spirit then brings us to repentance, and the mourning for our sins. They shall mourn as for an only son, the firstborn who had been killed, or who had been slain. The great mourning and grieving when the nation Israel realizes that they have rejected the Messiah. When God by His Spirit, opens their eyes to the truth and they realize, "We missed the real Messiah." That mourning, that grieving that will take place within their hearts. For God by His Spirit will open their eyes, and suddenly they will realize the blunder of crucifying the Lord of glory. This will take place after the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. If the Gentiles are the Church now then is it the Church (your idea of Israel now) that looks upon Him whom they pierced. No that can only be done by physical Israel. So then in Gods plan there are two separate entities 1)Israel 2) the Church. Each one complete and separate in identity in Gods plan for the last days. But in replacement theology you replace Israel with the Church and run into many problems with prophecy.
DeaconDan wrote

I said at that point there was no physical state of Israel. Moses could not have been talking about a geopolitical country (i.e. the state of Israel). The nation he spoke of was spiritual.

Israel was geopolitical. You see Abraham had been promised the land and all his descendants. So Israel had a geographical location from the time of Abraham. Also there was a ruling system that was to be divided up into 12 regions of rule that the elders of Israel would rule from. This was instituted by prophecy to Jacob. So the two things that determines geopolitical status is geography (the promised land) and politics (twelve tribes and elders to rule).

DeaconDan wrote

I contend that it was his strong faith in God that won him a visit from Jesus.

It wasn’t because of Pauls faith that Jesus visited Paul but it was because he had been chosen from his mothers womb to be elect of God

Galatians 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,

It was God’s sovereign choice that brought about the visit from Jesus not Paul’s strong faith

DeaconDan wrote

Are you a citizen of Israel?

No I am a fellowcitizen with Israel in the household of God

Ephesians 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

[DeaconDan]

Here you outright say that the Hebrews/Israel/Jews are not Abrahams seed. Yet in this next statement you admit that the Hebrews/Israel/Jews are the physical seed of Abraham

Abraham had physical seed, including the Arabs and Jesus. Abraham has spiritual seed, that is anybody in Christ, i.e. Christians. An Arab could just as well have old Jesus that he is the seed of Abraham. Jesus would have replied, "I know you are." If Jesus did not recognize those people in John 8 as the physical seed of Abraham, it would have proved nothing when he turns around and denies that they are Abraham's seed, but are children of Satin. Jesus is proving that only the spiritual seed of Abraham count toward the promise, not the Arabs, or whatever, as you suppose.

Galatians 3:16The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. The Scripture does not say "and to seeds," meaning many people, but "and to your seed," meaning one person, who is Christ. Simple enough for a child to understand.

But I ask what was the promise to Abraham. With the call of Abram, later named Abraham, God began a people whose descendants are living in ethnic purity to this very day.

There is no such thing as a Jewish race today. The last remains of it melted away almost 2000 years ago, after the Romans destroyed Jerusalem.

Israel was geopolitical. You see Abraham had been promised the land and all his descendants.

When Moses spoke, there was no geopolitical state on Earth called Israel. The Promised Land is not in the middle-east, or this world.

No I am a fellowcitizen with Israel in the household of God

I am a Christian, therefor I am a citizen of Israel.

Ephesians 2:12Remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ... 19Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens with God's people and members of God's household.

Anything else is of Satin.

This is where I get off this thread.

[Richard_1]

DeaconDan wrote

There is no such thing as a Jewish race today. The last remains of it melted away almost 2000 years ago, after the Romans destroyed Jerusalem.

This is the epitome of your blazon “replacement theology” by saying that there is no Jewish race. That they were all destroyed after the Romans destroyed Jerusalem. There is a huge archive of information that proves that your point is historically in error.

In Spanish archives dating from the 13th and 14th centuries there are records of many detailed orders issued by those most devout Catholic Kings of Castile and Aragon, instructing their no less devout officials to co-operate with the rabbis in enforcing observance of the Sabbath by the Jews. Why? Because whenever a Jew was fined by a rabbinical court for violating the Sabbath, the rabbis had to hand nine tenths of the fine over to the king - a very profitable and effective arrangement.

Here in the 13th century the Jews are recognized as a people with racial and religious distinction. Nicholas I of Russia was a notorious anti-Semite and issued many laws against the Jews of his state.

Czar Nicholas I (reign: 1825-1855) sought to destroy all Jewish life in Russia and his reign constitutes a painful part of European Jewish history.

There have to be a racially identifiable people to be able to mount a persecution against them. Yet you would have us believe that the Jewish race does not exist today. In 1850, the number of Jews in Russia stood at around 2,350,000 whereas it almost doubled to 5,000,000 by the late 19th century.

Here is a timeline of many of the historical mentions and information of the Jewish race

610--- Visigothic ruler Sesbut prohibits Judaism after several anti-Jewish edicts are ignored. Exiled Jews return to Byzantine Spain under Sesbut's successor, Swintilla.
614--- Persian General Romizanes captures Jerusalem and allows Jews to run the city. At this time, aproximately 150,000 Jews are living in 43 settlements in Eretz-Israel.
682--- Visigoth King Erwig continues oppression of Jews, making it illegal to practice any Jewish rites and pressing for the conversion or emigration of the remaining Jews.
1095--- Henry IV of Germany, who granted Jews favorable conditions whenever possible, issued a charter to the Jews and a decree against forced baptism. 9here Germany recognized the Jewish race)
1215--- Magna Carta. Two clauses concern debts due to Jews (here we have mention of the Jewish race in the Magna Carta)
1215--- The Church's Fourth Lateran Council decrees that Jews be differentiated from others by their type of clothing to avoid intercourse between Jews and Christians. Jews are sometimes required to wear a badge; sometimes a pointed hat.
1227-1274--- Christian theologian, who called for the slavery of all Jews, Saint Thomas Aquinas
1290--- Bowing political pressure, English King Edward I expels the Jews from England. They were only allowed to take what they could carry and most went to France, paying for thier passage only to be robbed and cast overboard by the ship captains.
1306--- Philip IV orders all Jews expelled from France, with their property to be sold at public auction. Some 125,000 Jews are forced to leave.
1386--- Emperor Wenceslaus expelles the Jews from Strassbourg and confiscate their property.
1389--- Pope Boniface continues the policy of Clement VI, forbidding the Christians to harm Jews, destroy their cemeteries or forcibly baptize them.

The list of historical accounts of the existence of the Jewish race is extremely long and to make this post short I will leave you with this that the Jewish race existed long after the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem and in fact exists today.

You state that believing anything else than what you believe is of Satan. Are you sure that the elimination of the Jewish race by your theology is not the design of Satans continuous assault on the people of God (Israel/Jews)

So in the last days, Israel again is going to be facing a time of persecution. These people who have gone through historically such tremendous persecution, the inquisition in Spain, the slaughter by Hitler and now the persecution in Russia, these people have had such a tremendous share of persecution. There are people who hate them that don't even know why they hate them. Anti-Semitism is an evil, wicked thing, but it is so prevalent.

[DeaconDan]

There is a huge archive of information that proves that your point is historically in error.

Your historical archive only shows that there have been people for the last 2000 years who claim to be Jewish. Considering that Rabbinical Judaism is a religion, anyone can become a Jew. There will be people becoming Jews and then calling themselves Jews. That does not make being a Jew a race. When a modern Jew claims to belong to the Jewish race, they mean a spiritual race of Abraham, which is Satanic in a Christian perspective.

Next time you meet someone who claims to be a Jew, ask him for his genealogy back to Jacob. No one asks because everyone knows that Jews do not have that evidence. In the mean time, introduce me to a DNA study documenting the existence of a Jewish race. Did you know know that a person can convert and become a Jew?

Do you know why you call them Jews instead of Israelites? People usually do not even call them Jews, but "Jewish". Do you know what -ish means?

You state that believing anything else than what you believe is of Satan.

Under Christian theology, Christians are the citizens of Israel and Christians are the (spiritual) seed of Abraham. I quote the verses and you do not respond to them. Who do you think Jesus means here, Revelation 3:9 I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars... In another thread, you and I discussed them simply as "Jews". The difference between when that was written and now is that many people claiming to be Jews then could tell you their genealogy back to Jacob. Yet, Jesus calls them liars. Why would Jesus call them liars? How much more so a liar is someone who claims to be a Jew today but has no evidence of it?

Anti-Semitism is an evil, wicked thing, but it is so prevalent.

If everyone hates you, it is probably something to do with you. Israel oppressing Palestinians, spies on the US, restricts Christianity, etc. They have not earned your support. You give it to them in spite of what they deserve, as a religious discipline.

[Richard_1]

DeaconDan wrote

Next time you meet someone who claims to be a Jew, ask him for his genealogy back to Jacob. No one asks because everyone knows that Jews do not have that evidence. In the mean time, introduce me to a DNA study documenting the existence of a Jewish race.

Recently published research in the field of molecular genetics—the study of DNA sequences—indicates that Jewish populations of the various Diaspora communities have retained their genetic identity throughout the exile. Despite large geographic distances between the communities and the passage of thousands of years, far removed Jewish communities share a similar genetic profile. This research confirms the common ancestry and common geographical origin of world Jewry. Jewish men from communities which developed in the Near East—Iran, Iraq, Kurdistan, Yemen—and European Jews have very similar, almost identical genetic profiles.

"Despite their long-term residence in different countries and isolation from one another, most Jewish populations were not significantly different from one another at the genetic level. The results support the hypothesis that the paternal gene pools of Jewish communities from Europe, North Africa and the Middle East descended from a common Middle Eastern ancestral population, and suggest that most Jewish communities have remained relatively isolated from neighboring non-Jewish communities during and after the Diaspora."

- M.F. Hammer, Proc. Nat'l Academy of Science, May 9, 2000

M F Hammer is a professor and researcher of genetics at the University of Arizona and wrote this article for the National Academy of Sciences. Here is another article by M F Hammer and other researchers speaking about the DNA of the Jewish race.

In addition to oral tradition and copious historical evidence, the genetic evidence stands firmly behind the common ancestry of both Ashkenazim and Sephardim in the Near East, and against any non-Jewish origin for either of these groups. Below are a collection of scientific journal articles including abstracts available worldwide on Pubmed and Medline.
Jewish and middle eastern non-jewish populations share a common pool of Y-chromosome biallelic haplotypes.

Hammer MF, Redd AJ, Wood ET, Bonner MR, Jarjanazi H, Karafet T, Santachiara-Benerecetti S, Oppenheim A, Jobling MA, Jenkins T, Ostrer H, Bonne-Tamir B

Laboratory of Molecular Systematics and Evolution, University of Arizona, Tucson, AZ 85721; Department of Genetics, Universita degli Studi di Pavia, Pavia 27100, Italy; Hadassah Medical School, Hebrew University of Jerusalem, Jerusalem 91120, Israel.

And another article about the DNA factors of the Jewish race

Haplotypes constructed from Y-chromosome markers were used to trace the paternal origins of the Jewish Diaspora. A set of 18 biallelic polymorphisms was genotyped in 1,371 males from 29 populations, including 7 Jewish (Ashkenazi, Roman, North African, Kurdish, Near Eastern, Yemenite, and Ethiopian) and 16 non-Jewish groups from similar geographic locations. The Jewish populations were characterized by a diverse set of 13 haplotypes that were also present in non-Jewish populations from Africa, Asia, and Europe. A series of analyses was performed to address whether modern Jewish Y-chromosome diversity derives mainly from a common Middle Eastern source population or from admixture with neighboring non-Jewish populations during and after the Diaspora. Despite their long-term residence in different countries and isolation from one another, most Jewish populations were not significantly different from one another at the genetic level. Admixture estimates suggested low levels of European Y-chromosome gene flow into Ashkenazi and Roman Jewish communities. A multidimensional scaling plot placed six of the seven Jewish populations in a relatively tight cluster that was interspersed with Middle Eastern non-Jewish populations, including Palestinians and Syrians. Pairwise differentiation tests further indicated that these Jewish and Middle Eastern non-Jewish populations were not statistically different. The results support the hypothesis that the paternal gene pools of Jewish communities from Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East descended from a common Middle Eastern ancestral population, and suggest that most Jewish communities have remained relatively isolated from neighboring non-Jewish communities during and after the Diaspora.

PMID: 10801975, UI: 20300976
Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A 2000 Jun 6;97(12):6769-74

There is also what is known as the Cohen factor and was developed by Dr. Skorecki who along with Professor Michael Hammer, of the University of Arizona, a leading researcher in molecular genetics and a pioneer in Y chromosome research. Professor Hammer uses DNA analysis to study the history of populations, their origins and migrations. The study shows Dr. Skorecki and associates gathering more DNA samples and expanding their selection of Y chromosome markers. Solidifying their hypothesis of the Cohens’ common ancestor, they found that a particular array of six chromosomal markers was found in 97 of the 106 Cohens tested. This collection of markers has come to be known as the Cohen Modal Hapoltype (CMH)—the standard genetic signature of the Jewish priestly family.

The Cohen Modal Hapoltype is the tracing of the genetic markers from the tribe of Levi.

Why do you want to eliminate the Jewish people and claim their heritage and the Promises of God to these people?

[DeaconDan]

Recently published research in the field of molecular genetics—the study of DNA sequences—indicates that Jewish populations of the various Diaspora communities have retained their genetic identity throughout the exile. Despite large geographic distances between the communities and the passage of thousands of years, far removed Jewish communities share a similar genetic profile. This research confirms the common ancestry and common geographical origin of world Jewry. Jewish men from communities which developed in the Near East—Iran, Iraq, Kurdistan, Yemen—and European Jews have very similar, almost identical genetic profiles.

Looking at your sources, it seems Jews are a male-only race of Palestinians.

One of you quotes says, "Despite their long-term residence in different countries and isolation from one another, most Jewish populations were not significantly different from one another at the genetic level." That claim is based on y-chromosome (men) comparisons. Your source goes on to say (but, you did not quote) "the Palestinians and Syrians were so close to the Jews in genetic characteristics that they 'mapped within the central cluster of Jewish populations.'"

From the Jewish sources you provided, we can conclude that they cannot even begin to identify a distinct Jewish race from Arabs. A significant amount of Jews do not have this DNA (just "most", and even that is largely circular and so not very meaningful), but a significant number of non-Jews, even non-Arabs do have this DNA. They cannot even begin to link Jewish female DNA to Arab stock (which tells you about the full genome of the men, no commonality).

Let me share with you some raw numbers. Speaking of only y-chromosomes and limited to Ashkenazi Jews (whom anyone would expect to be more closely related to each other than to other groups), of Haplogroup-D2, 13% of Ashkenazi Jews share this Haplogroup. D3 4%, E 20%; E1b 40%, R1a 10%. Every other Haplogroup, is either under 1% or I do not have the data. Those should all be 100% for a pure race.

What Haplogroup did Jacob have? Did he have D3? E? Even if we assume (begging the question) that Ashkenazi Jews are a race descended from Jacob (rather than say Khazar converts), we still cannot determine Jacob's y-chromosome DNA because they are too genetically diverse.

There is no Jewish race. There is zero evidence of the modern existence of a Jewish race. But, I concede that there are Arabs. If the Khazars converted to Judaism, they would have Arab DNA, not German (Ashkenazi) DNA.

The Bible provides Joseph's and Mary's genealogy to prove they are Jews. God did not supply those genealogies through miraculous inspiration. Those were from Jewish records, records that were destroyed when God had the Romans destroy Jerusalem in 70AD. Why would God let/have those records destroyed?

Why do you want to eliminate the Jewish people and claim their heritage and the Promises of God to these people?

Why do you ignore the verses I quote proving Christians are the heirs of those promises? What about the Arab people's claim to the Promises of God made to Abraham? They exist and they are the seed of Abraham.